Kim
EV Enthusiast
Posts: 49 
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Post by Kim on Sept 23, 2016 12:34:10 GMT 11
Hello All, My current car is a Prius Gen 3 model which just had the hybrid battery replaced (under warranty) but still has errors displaying (possible inverter related - it's at the dealer getting diagnosed at a cost of $140/hour for the diagnosis). It has turned me off Prius completely. So at the moment, I am considering a second hand Leaf or new Hyundai i30 Diesel to replace the Prius. The Hyundai Diesels report a fuel consumption of 4.9L/100km (however in reality is probably 5.5L-6L). I live in the western suburbs of Sydney and travel round trip only 20 kms to and from work daily (no motorways), occasionally 30-40 kms a day if I need to take kids to sporting commitments. Some questions I have in regards to charging the Leaf: - Does it have to be charged inside in a garage? We don't have a garage, so would need to charge in the driveway (no carport). What happens when it rains?
- I've read a few posts mentioning the 12 bars, but I haven't seen any pictures to know what to look for when test driving.
- What is a reasonable price to pay for a used Leaf? There is a red 2012 one on carsales at Steve Jarvin in Burwood advertised for $32,990 with 10,xxx KMS.
- In regards to servicing, is there a particular dealer in Sydney that knows these cars well?
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Thank you in advance.
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Post by pharmadave on Sept 23, 2016 13:43:53 GMT 11
Hi Kimmy176, welcome to the forum.
I'm new to the forum also and I recently went through the process of searching for a Nissan Leaf.
Regarding the price of a Leaf, as far as I know they are all used/dealer demo/Nissan Australia demos now. So the one you are looking at in red would fit into one of those categories.
I would ignore the Redbook valuation of the Leaf as I think it's way off, there just isn't that many Leafs available for sale and I guess people tend to hold onto them because of all the advantages of an EV compared to conventional vehicles as long their travel needs and habits allow it.
I set myself a budget of $25k for a used leaf and with the Nissan demo I found from Northside Nissan in Perth, I got pretty close. I will have to pay on-roads when it is transported and registered in Victoria but it does have a bit of factory warranty left and has done 26,000 Kms.
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Post by Phoebe on Sept 23, 2016 13:55:01 GMT 11
My daughter has 2 Prius, one of them for about 10 years, so you've just been unlucky. My Leaf is under cover but the 15amp power point I plug into would get wet so I never charge in the rain. There are 2 panels with bars on the dash. The left hand one tells the temperature of the battery, which is important and the right had one has twelve bars, divided into 2 halves, the left half tells you the SOC, or ow much charge you now have, and the right hand half tells you the SOH, or how much of the battery is functioning when fully charged. 12 bars means the battery is still like new but for each bar less means less distance you can go on a full charge. $32,990 is too much to pay for a second hand LEAF now as they are all 2012 models not matter when they were purchased. $20,000 to $25,000 would be a more reasonable price. I bought my LEAF from Mildren in Artarmon and I wouldn't recommend them, but I am in Maitland, get my LEAF serviced in Newcastle, and don't know about other dealers in Sydney.
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Post by 4wardthinking on Sept 23, 2016 15:02:51 GMT 11
Hello All, My current car is a Prius Gen 3 model which just had the hybrid battery replaced (under warranty) but still has errors displaying (possible inverter related - it's at the dealer getting diagnosed at a cost of $140/hour for the diagnosis). It has turned me off Prius completely. So at the moment, I am considering a second hand Leaf or new Hyundai i30 Diesel to replace the Prius. The Hyundai Diesels report a fuel consumption of 4.9L/100km (however in reality is probably 5.5L-6L). I live in the western suburbs of Sydney and travel round trip only 20 kms to and from work daily (no motorways), occasionally 30-40 kms a day if I need to take kids to sporting commitments. Some questions I have in regards to charging the Leaf: - Does it have to be charged inside in a garage? We don't have a garage, so would need to charge in the driveway (no carport). What happens when it rains?
- I've read a few posts mentioning the 12 bars, but I haven't seen any pictures to know what to look for when test driving.
- What is a reasonable price to pay for a used Leaf? There is a red 2012 one on carsales at Steve Jarvin in Burwood advertised for $32,990 with 10,xxx KMS.
- In regards to servicing, is there a particular dealer in Sydney that knows these cars well?
[/ul]
Thank you in advance.
[/quote] First thing I'd do is get hold of Toyota HQ. If the HV battery was changed under warranty, it's more than a coincidence that all of a sudden, the inverter fails. Word-wide there have been very few failures, and most worries were quickly resolved. They are very easy to diagnose as a car goes, in fact much easier than a ice based car. If not, just connect to Techstream. If you can't, and you get the codes, I'll tell you what is wrong, ..if not bad workmanship. My Prii only visited the dealer once, and came away with more problems than it went in with. Had five, and all ran as sweet as the day I got them, in fact, we sold a few of our cars recently, and kept our 2001 Prius. Get the dealer to read the codes as part of their previous diagnosis, which should be complimentary, and take it from there. There are very few that can understand Prii in our side of the world, dealers included. Our Prius stands testament to that right now. Condemned to scrap almost 9 years ago. Has now covered 234,000kms, and has not once let us down. However..... all being said, a LEAF is better if you don't travel more than 100km between charges(more or less), but beware bad info on battery bars. Ours has 74%, or ten bars, and has a freeway(>95%) capability of 116kms... before the safety reserve will alarm you. Charging is easy. Standard charge "thingy" in the boot and a good cable with 56P315 plug on it(Nissan EVSE end), to a 56CSC315 socket on the cable will give adequate weather protection. Just buy one on the net, or get a electrically minded person to do it for you. Get the codes from Toyota before authorising any work!. |
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Post by 4wardthinking on Sept 23, 2016 15:11:03 GMT 11
By the way.
Diesel vehicles are looking at being banned from major cities around the world for obvious reasons.
Now if you buy one, you could!! Be left holding the ball if Australia sees why.
My father bought a BMW Diesel, brand new in March, and is getting panicky about resale value already.
He IS going LEAF soon.
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Kim
EV Enthusiast
Posts: 49
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Post by Kim on Sept 23, 2016 16:32:31 GMT 11
Thanks so much fellow Pri owner for your reply. The car had a major 120K service on Saturday 27/08 (the car has done 92K but due to age, it's a 2009, it was due for it's 6 month service). The total service cost was almost $1.2K (was quoted at $0.9K but they asked to do a throttle body clean and change the wipers over the phone). The following Saturday 03/09 is when it displayed "check hybrid system" warning and gave the codes below. It only showed the P0A94 code for me (using obd adapter and Torque app). It has been at the dealer since Thursday 08/09 as that's when they could fit it in. From what I've read online this code points to inverter failure which isn't covered in Australia under the 8 year hybrid warranty (it is covered in the US though). These are the emails from the Toyota dealer: <quote>I believe I have answered any questions you have sent me. I will put it all together for you as they were scattered through multiple email replies. Your Prius was presented to us with the fault codes as follows: P0a94/ 557 or 553 C1259 C1310 We started with the hv battery replacement as the codes we had pointed to the battery which we knew needed replacement and this could be done for you under warranty as the hv battery is covered for 8 year \160000 km. Codes c1259 and c1310 have not reappeared since the hv battery replacement. The warning lights are still on the display. A road test was carried out and the fault is still there after the hv battery was replaced. The code p0a94 is still present and will need further investigation . After speaking to the tech who has been working on your car he has said there is a possibility that whatever is causing the p0a94 code has caused the fault in the hv battery. The service advisor who is looking after your car tried to call both of the numbers left with us on Thursday and left messages but we have not had a reply. At this point we will need your authorisation to continue to investigate this further as this will be at your expense due to the vehicle no longer being within the warranty period. Would you like us to continue the diagnosis of code p0a94? This code leads to quite a few different areas and the diagnosis is quite a lengthy task. Our labour rate is $140 per hour but I will not be able to give you an exact quote on repairs until we find the cause of this code.<end quote> 2nd email <quote>When work began on your Prius we retrieved 3 fault codes from the vehicle. After some testing we found that there was a fault with the hybrid battery. This was a good place to start as the hybrid battery was still covered under its 8year\160000 km warranty and could be replaced at no cost to you. After the hybrid battery was replaced 2 out of the 3 fault codes have not reappeared which tells the hybrid battery was part of the issue. There is still one of the fault codes present and we will need to further diagnose this particular fault. There is a possibility that what is causing this code is what has caused the hybrid battery to fail but at this stage we do not know for sure. As the vehicle is out of the warranty period of 3years\100000km to further diagnose this particular code, there will be a charge depending on how long it takes to find the fault whilst following the diagnostic procedure as per the workshop manual. We will then be able to inform you on what the issue is and what needs to be done to rectify it. At This stage you have not been charged for any repair on this vehicle. If you would like us to continue the diagnosis on the vehicle there will be a labour charge of $140 per hour. We will then be able to give you a quote for the entire repair which will include time spent to diagnose. If you then choose not to carry out the repair you will only be charged the time spent to diagnose the fault. If you would not like us to continue and would prefer to take the vehicle elsewhere you are quite welcome to do so and as stated at this stage there will be no charge to you.</quote> |
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Post by 4wardthinking on Sept 23, 2016 19:43:56 GMT 11
Thanks so much fellow Pri owner for your reply. The car had a major 120K service on Saturday 27/08 (the car has done 92K but due to age, it's a 2009, it was due for it's 6 month service). The total service cost was almost $1.2K (was quoted at $0.9K but they asked to do a throttle body clean and change the wipers over the phone). The following Saturday 03/09 is when it displayed "check hybrid system" warning and gave the codes below. It only showed the P0A94 code for me (using obd adapter and Torque app). It has been at the dealer since Thursday 08/09 as that's when they could fit it in. From what I've read online this code points to inverter failure which isn't covered in Australia under the 8 year hybrid warranty (it is covered in the US though). These are the emails from the Toyota dealer: <quote>I believe I have answered any questions you have sent me. I will put it all together for you as they were scattered through multiple email replies. Your Prius was presented to us with the fault codes as follows: P0a94/ 557 or 553 C1259 C1310 We started with the hv battery replacement as the codes we had pointed to the battery which we knew needed replacement and this could be done for you under warranty as the hv battery is covered for 8 year \160000 km. Codes c1259 and c1310 have not reappeared since the hv battery replacement. The warning lights are still on the display. A road test was carried out and the fault is still there after the hv battery was replaced. The code p0a94 is still present and will need further investigation . After speaking to the tech who has been working on your car he has said there is a possibility that whatever is causing the p0a94 code has caused the fault in the hv battery. The service advisor who is looking after your car tried to call both of the numbers left with us on Thursday and left messages but we have not had a reply. At this point we will need your authorisation to continue to investigate this further as this will be at your expense due to the vehicle no longer being within the warranty period. Would you like us to continue the diagnosis of code p0a94? This code leads to quite a few different areas and the diagnosis is quite a lengthy task. Our labour rate is $140 per hour but I will not be able to give you an exact quote on repairs until we find the cause of this code.<end quote> 2nd email <quote>When work began on your Prius we retrieved 3 fault codes from the vehicle. After some testing we found that there was a fault with the hybrid battery. This was a good place to start as the hybrid battery was still covered under its 8year\160000 km warranty and could be replaced at no cost to you. After the hybrid battery was replaced 2 out of the 3 fault codes have not reappeared which tells the hybrid battery was part of the issue. There is still one of the fault codes present and we will need to further diagnose this particular fault. There is a possibility that what is causing this code is what has caused the hybrid battery to fail but at this stage we do not know for sure. As the vehicle is out of the warranty period of 3years\100000km to further diagnose this particular code, there will be a charge depending on how long it takes to find the fault whilst following the diagnostic procedure as per the workshop manual. We will then be able to inform you on what the issue is and what needs to be done to rectify it. At This stage you have not been charged for any repair on this vehicle. If you would like us to continue the diagnosis on the vehicle there will be a labour charge of $140 per hour. We will then be able to give you a quote for the entire repair which will include time spent to diagnose. If you then choose not to carry out the repair you will only be charged the time spent to diagnose the fault. If you would not like us to continue and would prefer to take the vehicle elsewhere you are quite welcome to do so and as stated at this stage there will be no charge to you.</quote> Hmmm, this doesn't make sense to me. A service is around $50 normally. Add the spark plugs & air filter, could run to $160-ish. Spark plug change at 100,000kms is correct. I wonder IF the HV pack was faulty. It's normally around 170k mark on model 2, unless one cell in one module failed, which happened to me. Fixed for $45. We parted ways six weeks ago sadly. It would get to 220kkms and was iTech too. That service & disaster following are typical of why I avoid them. Oil service is filter & oil, should be $60 top side, brakes would be good for another 70kkms without seeing the car;). I have Techstream here. The usual is that C1259 series is bad HV pack or wired in incorrectly. It's not re-absorbing brake energy. Where is it at present. It's one of my pet gear grinders is shoddy service/inflated pricing. My wife services ours, and takes under half an hour!!. I'm more than happy to be your advocate here. It sounds like bad replacement and practice to me. If it's local to me, I'll come along and fillet the dealer with you. Service is asked for prematurely, HV pack replaced similarly to me, or at least questionable. It should not cost you for warranty work!!. If you like, pm me, and I'll have a chat, and help out. It's this sort of thing that gives good technology a bad name. Most don't understand it if it hasn't got a V8 in it sadly. |
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Post by 4wardthinking on Sept 23, 2016 19:49:18 GMT 11
But reading their correspondence.
There are massive holes in their methodology and solution finding.
If not, I'd drag them to fair trading. It all smacks me of "customer paying for us to learn".
If their initial diagnosis was correct about the HV pack, the invertor would have been in the list too, it wasn't.
Good old franchise grabbing cash from Toyota.
Japan service would never be so vague!.
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Post by caskings on Sept 23, 2016 20:48:13 GMT 11
As long as you can keep the wall plug end of the travel charger out of the weather it should be fine. My car lives outside and I just leave the charger plug on the concrete with the dust cap on.
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