What percentage of Range is reduced with AC on?

[bmsweb]

Firstly this forum is fantastic, only found it last night and so much more useful info here than Nissan can provide.

We're monitoring our driving here in Melbourne and trying to get a feel for how and where we would utilise the leaf. In any case wanted to know if anyone has an idea of ball park figure as to the range reduction when running the Aircon. We did heaps of driving from home to Williamstown, then to the Vic Market, then to Bowling and then home. We did way more driving than our usual for an average saturday and we clocked up 100km on pretty flat roads and Freeways. I guess I wanted to know if that was realistic or possible with the Aircon running.

Thanks
Paul

[caskings]

AC usually only makes a couple of km difference in range. The biggest I've seen is 16km estimate difference when I was driving around on at 40c+ day after leaving it outside.

However it's the cold that will give you the biggest hit in range as the Leaf (2012 build) uses a resistive heater rather than reverse cycle A/C

[hieronymous]

Feb 21, 2015 17:12:30 GMT 11 bmsweb said:

Firstly this forum is fantastic, only found it last night and so much more useful info here than Nissan can provide.

We're monitoring our driving here in Melbourne and trying to get a feel for how and where we would utilise the leaf. In any case wanted to know if anyone has an idea of ball park figure as to the range reduction when running the Aircon. We did heaps of driving from home to Williamstown, then to the Vic Market, then to Bowling and then home. We did way more driving than our usual for an average saturday and we clocked up 100km on pretty flat roads and Freeways. I guess I wanted to know if that was realistic or possible with the Aircon running.

Thanks
Paul

100km can be a little or a lot depending on what level the car is charged to, how low you are prepared to run down the battery, what load you have on board, what speeds you travel at etc etc etc. 120-125km is easily achievable around the city from a 100% charge, and a/c would probably only knock that back by 5km or so.

You can minimise the impact by turning the a/c on, moving the temperature setting to minimum (18C), then slowly increasing the temperature setting until the fan speed starts to drop - you can hear it.

if you push the Zero emission button (hit OK), then Energy Information, the estimated range is shown at top left, and the impact of your chosen climate control settings On or Off top right.

In your Electric Vehicle Information System Owner's Manual it's under Energy Information Display on p.2-6.

[bmsweb]

Thanks for the information guys, that helps heaps. I actually thought the AC was going to be more of an issue than the heater. Why is it that in Australia we only have the 2012 model? I also assume that the B Driving Mode isn't available on the Aussie Leaf? Irrespective it's great to know that 100km is achievable with a full Charge. In all honesty I doubt that would occur very often and the plan is to still keep our Holden Calais so for longer trips that would be the go. We're a family of 3 so I think the Leaf could be the go for us

Thanks for all the help guys. We spoke with Nissan and the honestly had no idea. I asked if our 15amp outlet would charge the car and were told no you have to install there Charging Sytem.

[Phoebe]

That is rubbish! You don't have to install their charging system! I haven't.  I have installed a dedicated 15 amp power point and plug the LEAF portable EVSE in to that.  I've had my LEAF well over 2 years and always charge it that way.

[caskings]

Feb 21, 2015 21:26:51 GMT 11 bmsweb said:

Thanks for the information guys, that helps heaps. I actually thought the AC was going to be more of an issue than the heater. Why is it that in Australia we only have the 2012 model? I also assume that the B Driving Mode isn't available on the Aussie Leaf? Irrespective it's great to know that 100km is achievable with a full Charge. In all honesty I doubt that would occur very often and the plan is to still keep our Holden Calais so for longer trips that would be the go. We're a family of 3 so I think the Leaf could be the go for us

Thanks for all the help guys. We spoke with Nissan and the honestly had no idea. I asked if our 15amp outlet would charge the car and were told no you have to install there Charging Sytem.

Thankfully the AC unit is quite efficient.

Nissan bought in a batch in 2012 and it was priced higher than the market was willing to bear, now at 40k it's moving.

No B mode.

My family of 4 has been happy with it. Enough legroom in the back for Mr 10 and Miss 7. Certainly better than our Suzuki Swift.

I didn't buy the Charging system. I just use the travel EVSE that comes with the car.

[southernvolt]

Feb 21, 2015 21:26:51 GMT 11 bmsweb said:

Thanks for the information guys, that helps heaps. I actually thought the AC was going to be more of an issue than the heater. Why is it that in Australia we only have the 2012 model? I also assume that the B Driving Mode isn't available on the Aussie Leaf? Irrespective it's great to know that 100km is achievable with a full Charge. In all honesty I doubt that would occur very often and the plan is to still keep our Holden Calais so for longer trips that would be the go. We're a family of 3 so I think the Leaf could be the go for us

Thanks for all the help guys. We spoke with Nissan and the honestly had no idea. I asked if our 15amp outlet would charge the car and were told no you have to install there Charging Sytem.

100KM's is a piece of cake actually. Even with all the hills around where I live I am absolutely confident of 120KM's no matter what, on a 100% charge. I usually charge to 80%, do my 70km round trip for work and return home with 40 kms left showing on the GOM. Summer of course. I've yet to do a full winter.

As others have said the heater knocks it for six but the aircon hardly at all. When I use the aircon the range estimate drops by 10ish km's but I don't think that's true. When you look at your usage dials (as above in the energy display) the aircon doesn't use nearly as much as heat but I think the GOM just changes the range when you put "climate control" on. I think 5km's is probably right.

[southernvolt]

Oh yeah, also don't have the charger installed. I bought the jaycar 10amp to 15 amp converter ($40) and just plug into my carport using the supplied EVSE. Have done for 15,000 kms now.

[jeffjl]

Feb 21, 2015 22:24:56 GMT 11 Phoebe said:

That is rubbish! You don't have to install their charging system! I haven't.  I have installed a dedicated 15 amp power point and plug the LEAF portable EVSE in to that.  I've had my LEAF well over 2 years and always charge it that way.

Come on Phoebe. Tell us what you really think.

[bmsweb]

Thanks Phoebe, They were actually telling me that Nissan would install a Fast Charger at my home and then on the other hand saying I shouldn't Fast Charge it lol It soon became very apparent that their expert had No idea at all about the car.

casings Thanks for the info, that makes sense. Good to know others haven't had to install Nissan's Charge Station either

southervolt I didn't realise there was the possibility of using a 10amp supply! What a fantastic tip. One of the issues I had was the distance my sister lives from us and it was unlikely I could take a leaf since they don't have 15amp supply. But that Jaycar adaptor could be the go for a few hours charge at her place before heading home.

jeffjl I love Phoebe's feelings on this You know the worse part about talking to Nissan was the complete lack of knowledge about their own car. Not very helpful and the worse part, they had no idea at all.

[gabzimiev]

with charging you have 3 options.

1. use the device provided with the car. (avoid using extension cords, and avoid using it on circuits where other devices are plugged in that use a lot of electricity ie dishwasher, heater, a/c or you'll blow a fuse). do get a dedicated 15amp powerpoint it's safer.

2. use a 3rd party device, and your own preferred electrician. I sell them rechargingnsw.com.au/ and there are now 3-4 other companies that do. my cheapest option is a e-series kecontact and sending riddick a pm ( ozleaf.proboards.com/user/47 ) to see if he has some ex better place cables.

3. don't think and just pay orgin/chargepoint do come do the whole thing install

[gabzimiev]

Also when they misused fast charge is the cable provided to car is limited to 2.3kW the car can do 3.3kW maximum recharge power. so using a origin or 3rd party will decrease your recharging time by a 0.67 so instead of full charged in 8 hours you are 5.36 hours. where as a real fast charger would have you to 80% recharged in 30-40 mins.

[Phoebe]

Feb 22, 2015 8:15:34 GMT 11 bmsweb said:

Thanks Phoebe, They were actually telling me that Nissan would install a Fast Charger at my home and then on the other hand saying I shouldn't Fast Charge it lol It soon became very apparent that their expert had No idea at all about the car.

casings Thanks for the info, that makes sense. Good to know others haven't had to install Nissan's Charge Station either

southervolt I didn't realise there was the possibility of using a 10amp supply! What a fantastic tip. One of the issues I had was the distance my sister lives from us and it was unlikely I could take a leaf since they don't have 15amp supply. But that Jaycar adaptor could be the go for a few hours charge at her place before heading home.

jeffjl I love Phoebe's feelings on this You know the worse part about talking to Nissan was the complete lack of knowledge about their own car. Not very helpful and the worse part, they had no idea at all.

Each Nissan dealer who stocks the LEAF, and not all of them do, has one person trained in all the details.  The first salesman I saw knew as little as your bloke does.  I complained to Nissan head office and Dean Despotovski sorted it out for me and put me on to the person at that dealership who knew about the LEAF.  I suggest you complain to Dean, who can be contacted at 1800 LEAF EV (1800 532 338) or by email at [e-mail] and let him find you someone who knows what they are talking about.

[bmsweb]

Thanks for all the help guys, I think I may decide on colour and see how we going trying to find one

[Jim Hare]

Welcome to the forum! Regarding colour, probably best to check availability before getting your heart set, I have a feeling they are starting to run low.

You will love the LEAF, it's an absolute dream! We were the first owners in the country and it's still our favourite topic.

Cheers,

Jim

[bmsweb]

Thanks Jim, I'll tell you another funny thing, I was my nephew's 20th birthday party and of all the guys I talked to that night, only 1 had ever heard of the Leaf. In fact only 2 weeks ago I had never heard of it. That really doesn't say much for Nissan's ability to market the product. It's really a shame because it seems like one hell of a product with so much good feedback from owners but most of the community have never heard about it. You should have seen how surprised people were when you told them its all electric.

BTW: I'm still slowly working my way through the forum, looks like a uniquely friendly bunch here

[empowerrepower]

Welcome to the forum, bmsweb. Given that you are in Melbourne looking for a car, you might like to check out the second-hand Leaf with low mileage and custom leather seats in Werribee at Car Sales: www.carsales.com.au/dealer/details/Nissan-LEAF-2013/AGC-AD-17177205/?Cr=3 There is another thread on here about it, I just don't know how to quote a thread.

I'm in Qld, but would have definitely looked at it rather than a new one if it had been closer.

[bmsweb]

Thanks for the heads up empowerrepower

My wife and myself took a drive to Werribee Nissan last Friday (that was the start of this) and they had 2 Blue Leafs, a new one and this Used one with Black Leather seats. Interestingly they were going to take us for a drive in this used one, but the battery had a range of 12km, so the sales person took us to the one with heaps more range . . . the brand new leaf that had 24km range lol

In any case when sitting in it, it did have a smell and not so pleasant. I couldn't figure out if it was a smokers car or not. The other thing to note, is the seats are black leather and it didn't seem to match anything else in the car. $28K sounds fantastic, but not sure about the seats or the smell.

[empowerrepower]

Hi bmsweb,
You are way ahead of me. Sad to hear about the smell and the mis-match between the seats and the car. It looked good in the photo, but as I've learned from buying things on the internet, photos can lie. I wonder whether the smell would come out with a good clean...

If you are doing any more test drives, perhaps ask them to charge up the car before you come.

[bmsweb]

Feb 26, 2015 23:41:06 GMT 11 empowerrepower said:

Hi bmsweb,
You are way ahead of me. Sad to hear about the smell and the mis-match between the seats and the car. It looked good in the photo, but as I've learned from buying things on the internet, photos can lie. I wonder whether the smell would come out with a good clean...

If you are doing any more test drives, perhaps ask them to charge up the car before you come.

Yes it's a worry hey The price looked good but I wasn't sure about the smell etc, I honestly can't say for sure it had been smoked in, but it smelled nothing like the new one I tried. I'm going to check out another one on Monday that is Silver in colour but new. I've only ever seen the Leaf in Blue.

BTW: My son and I fly RC Aircraft in First Person View, so our day to day life involves lots and lots of LiPo battery charging so hence why I think it would be cool to also have a re-chargeable Car

[elkarlos]

Hi guys, Karl here Western Australia, today Thurs 26-11-15 I charged my blue leaf or BLUEY as we call her, up to 100% and took her up to Belmont Perth from Warnbro. It was a hot day and on the way back discovered something interesting about the a/c and climate control in my leafs.
If I set the climate control to 25degrees which is comfortable for me it was way too cold and used way too much power, almost 1.5kw, it was showing 27C outside so I gradually raised the temp on the climate air to just below the outside ambient temp and woa and behold, the air coming out was still cool & refreshing but the power usage was minimal.
I left the climate set like this for the remaining 40ks home and was really pleased how it seemed to affect range to a very minimal amount, I would say as if the a/c was off.
Even though it doesn't make sense, the climate air was set to 27, it was still lovely and cool in the car with the climate air usuage on the screen bearly showing a bar.
Just thought I would mention it.

[rusdy]

Nov 27, 2015 1:29:37 GMT 11 elkarlos said:

Hi guys, Karl here Western Australia, today Thurs 26-11-15 I charged my blue leaf or BLUEY as we call her, up to 100% and took her up to Belmont Perth from Warnbro. It was a hot day and on the way back discovered something interesting about the a/c and climate control in my leafs.
If I set the climate control to 25degrees which is comfortable for me it was way too cold and used way too much power, almost 1.5kw, it was showing 27C outside so I gradually raised the temp on the climate air to just below the outside ambient temp and woa and behold, the air coming out was still cool & refreshing but the power usage was minimal.
I left the climate set like this for the remaining 40ks home and was really pleased how it seemed to affect range to a very minimal amount, I would say as if the a/c was off.
Even though it doesn't make sense, the climate air was set to 27, it was still lovely and cool in the car with the climate air usuage on the screen bearly showing a bar.
Just thought I would mention it.

Same here. 35C showing on the Leaf dashboard last week, 1.5kW for 5 minutes and then drop to almost nothing (set to 23C) when the cabin temperature cool down.

Can't say the same with heating though. When I used the the heater in winter, it's 3kW during start, then drop to 1kW. What a difference!

[hieronymous]

Nov 27, 2015 1:29:37 GMT 11 elkarlos said:

If I set the climate control to 25degrees which is comfortable for me it was way too cold and used way too much power, almost 1.5kw, it was showing 27C outside so I gradually raised the temp on the climate air to just below the outside ambient temp and woa and behold, the air coming out was still cool & refreshing but the power usage was minimal.
I left the climate set like this for the remaining 40ks home and was really pleased how it seemed to affect range to a very minimal amount, I would say as if the a/c was off.
Even though it doesn't make sense, the climate air was set to 27, it was still lovely and cool in the car with the climate air usuage on the screen bearly showing a bar.

It does make sense - a/c dehumidifies as well as cools, and it's the humidity that is unpleasant. So a/c air at 27C inside feels much cooler than humid air at 27C outside.

[duncan]

Feb 27, 2015 6:54:29 GMT 11 bmsweb said:

Yes it's a worry hey The price looked good but I wasn't sure about the smell etc, I honestly can't say for sure it had been smoked in, but it smelled nothing like the new one I tried. I'm going to check out another one on Monday that is Silver in colour but new. I've only ever seen the Leaf in Blue.

Actually the thing I'd be most interested in for a second hand car is battery health. Interior can be cleaned and if it worries you enough seats replaced with ones from a wrecked car. There is an android App called Leaf Spy, which together with a Bluetooth ODB dongle will give you exact details of the battery health, there are some threads on here about it.

Also I'd take Phoebe's advice and let Dean at Nissan know about the level of knowledge by the sales person for 2 reasons; 1 so the next prospective buyer doesn't get misled, and 2 because once he contacts the owner at the dealership you are likely to get looked after better...