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Post by rusdy on Jul 17, 2019 16:27:43 GMT 11
Hi seb, sounds good for 78%. My guess you'll have massive correction in the next couple of months once the car 'learn' the real capacity by your usage / charging cycle. Mine did this in the very beginning due to I use waaay more compared to previous owner.
What was the state of charge when your wife had that limited power notice ? Single bar left? Or at fully charged? If at full, you'd better get new battery from the warranty!!
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seb
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Post by seb on Jul 17, 2019 17:22:30 GMT 11
Hi seb, sounds good for 78%. My guess you'll have massive correction in the next couple of months once the car 'learn' the real capacity by your usage / charging cycle. Mine did this in the very beginning due to I use waaay more compared to previous owner. What was the state of charge when your wife had that limited power notice ? Single bar left? Or at fully charged? If at full, you'd better get new battery from the warranty!! Two bars but she picked it up at 7 bars and did maybe 10km on it. It also said I need to take it to the shop, saying that a vehicle inspection is required.
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Post by Feng on Jul 17, 2019 17:56:59 GMT 11
That's a strange one, be curious to know what's causing that. You'll be practically getting a new car if it gets its battery replaced under warranty. Too bad you didn't have LeafSpy on hand to read the error codes.
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seb
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Post by seb on Jul 17, 2019 19:34:29 GMT 11
That's a strange one, be curious to know what's causing that. You'll be practically getting a new car if it gets its battery replaced under warranty. Too bad you didn't have LeafSpy on hand to read the error codes. I have/had leafspy connected when this happened. How can you get the code? Is there a log?
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Post by Feng on Jul 17, 2019 19:48:34 GMT 11
You'd have to be connected to the car to download the codes. Under settings there's an option to enable the service menu and from there there's a button to "Read DTCs". I don't think you can look it up after test driving.
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seb
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Post by seb on Jul 17, 2019 20:09:10 GMT 11
Man, I wish I known that! I just enabled it.
I'll look it up if it comes up again.
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seb
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Post by seb on Jul 17, 2019 22:19:23 GMT 11
Did a full charge when it was at one bar. Charger said car took 10kWhr to fully charge.
Doesn’t this car have a 25kWhr battery? Something doesn’t make sense to me. Leafspy says it had 16kwhr after full charge on battery with 77.6% Health.
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Post by zuuutoootuuu on Jul 18, 2019 3:46:28 GMT 11
what DTC did you get? screen shot that
also, can you take a screen shot of leafspy showing all the blue/red battery bars
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Post by Feng on Jul 18, 2019 10:49:10 GMT 11
Man, I wish I known that! I just enabled it. I'll look it up if it comes up again. Sorry, I should clarify: The car will store the troubleshooting codes, you don't have to wait until the error message comes up. I thought you only test drove it and didn't have the car in your possesion when I wrote that. When I wrote it I meant you have to be connected to the car to download the codes, you can't look it up when you're not connected to the car. LeafSpy doesn't download and keep the DTCs in the background. That's what I meant.
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Kim
EV Enthusiast
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Post by Kim on Jul 18, 2019 10:57:39 GMT 11
How did you go Seb?
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seb
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Post by seb on Jul 18, 2019 17:13:03 GMT 11
Stupid question but how do you attach images in this forum? I charged it fully last night and lost 1/2 the battery with maybe 20km. I dropped it off a the dealership in Chatswood. They have a couple of guys that are trained for the new leaf. It may take about a month in backs and Forths to get it fixed. Will upload once I figured it out.
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Post by pharmadave on Jul 18, 2019 17:38:13 GMT 11
Stupid question but how do you attach images in this forum? I charged it fully last night and lost 1/2 the battery with maybe 20km. I dropped it off a the dealership in Chatswood. They have a couple of guys that are trained for the new leaf. It may take about a month in backs and Forths to get it fixed. Will upload once I figured it out. So just confirming what I'm reading, you lost 6 state of charge (SOC) bars after 20Kms of driving? Wow, that sounds like something is massively wrong with the battery and the BMS...
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Post by Feng on Jul 18, 2019 18:46:50 GMT 11
It might be a bad module holding back the rest of the pack. There's a guy in Canberra who owns a Leaf which does something similar. Unfortunately for him he was just outside of warranty when he lost his capacity 4th bar and had his claim denied. He wasn't happy about that. Personally if it was me it would be a good excuse for a DIY repair.
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seb
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Post by seb on Jul 18, 2019 20:53:35 GMT 11
It might be a bad module holding back the rest of the pack. There's a guy in Canberra who owns a Leaf which does something similar. Unfortunately for him he was just outside of warranty when he lost his capacity 4th bar and had his claim denied. He wasn't happy about that. Personally if it was me it would be a good excuse for a DIY repair. Hi Feng, One of the units looks bad. So it's possible. Thankfully I am within car warranty and dealers warranty too. Just thankful this popped up now. Hi pharmadave, That's right. Hi Kim, zuuutoootuuu, See below for the snapshots from LeafSpy. Is that what you meant zuuutoootuuu?
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Post by zuuutoootuuu on Jul 19, 2019 15:59:32 GMT 11
yes to the last screenshot with the battery bars, I suspect you have DTCs P3180 and P33ED which usually occur with a bad cell.
To get DTCs
1. click the 3 horizontal lines on the top right 2. a bar will open on the bottom of the screen with "View Trip Log" cog icon "About/Help" 3. click the cog icon 4. under the "service screen" menu, enable 5. click "done" on the top right of the screen 6. scroll to the very most right screen, it will be green and say "service menu" on the top 7. select "Read DTCs"
then screen shot the DTCs
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seb
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Post by seb on Jul 20, 2019 9:34:17 GMT 11
yes to the last screenshot with the battery bars, I suspect you have DTCs P3180 and P33ED which usually occur with a bad cell. To get DTCs 1. click the 3 horizontal lines on the top right 2. a bar will open on the bottom of the screen with "View Trip Log" cog icon "About/Help" 3. click the cog icon 4. under the "service screen" menu, enable 5. click "done" on the top right of the screen 6. scroll to the very most right screen, it will be green and say "service menu" on the top 7. select "Read DTCs" then screen shot the DTCs Attachments:
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Post by Feng on Jul 20, 2019 9:52:21 GMT 11
Try searching for the errors on the larger My Nissan Leaf forum, there's usually plenty of discussions on any problems we've encountered here on that site. The P33E6 error looks like the culprit.
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seb
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Post by seb on Jul 20, 2019 22:45:38 GMT 11
Try searching for the errors on the larger My Nissan Leaf forum, there's usually plenty of discussions on any problems we've encountered here on that site. The P33E6 error looks like the culprit. Hi Feng, I think you are right. Looks like it's also complaining about the 12V battery. Found a beautiful post essentially explaining the problem that I have (one bad cell making all out of balance) and how he fixed it himself! www.japtoys.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=3613Noting that my faulty cell is around the middle and my range is about half what I expect. Coincidence? Here are details on all errors that I could gather. *B2820 0028 Quick charger error: Low 12-volt battery will cause CAN bus communication errors so I would check for a weak battery or loose connections. So could be the acid battery (didn't know it had one until I looked) *P31C2 00C0: seems to also be related to 12-volt battery but on TCU (wings cellular unit) static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2018/MC-10143482-9999.pdf*P33E6 seems to be an out of balance cell module. Nicely detailed here www.japtoys.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=3613 *U1266 0208 Multi AV TCU Conn AV-92: indicates that you're using a 2G TCU (the cellmodem) and it was properly disconnected via the security mitigation TSB. Interesting about this one, is that the Nissan dealership dude told me the 2G TCU was replaced by a 3G one! Further enquiries will be required.
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seb
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Post by seb on Aug 5, 2019 13:15:10 GMT 11
Hi All, Took the car to the Nissan dealership in Chatswood two weeks ago. They've been following all recommendations from the Nissan Australia technical in Melbourne. One request was to drive car 4x from full to empty. They were getting 46km + 20km left over driving under 50km/hr with eco mode and no aircon. Other less efficient instances are 40 to 50km total range. They did not record how much charge went into it. They updated the ECU data to have more accurate range estimation (apparently). Nissan got back to say that everything is within spec, and won't do anything about it. I am starting a complaint process with them. The car only took 14kW/hr of charge when it had 9km left of range, it has a bad battery cell, and range is appalling. I guess they don't want to splash out $5k in a replacement battery... Nissan dealership guy has been very supportive, and told me that he expected this would happen, but that he thinks I have a good case. I guess it wasn't going to be easy. Feel free to share any thoughts if you had a similar experience, that I can use as arguments.
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Post by jeffthewalker on Aug 5, 2019 14:08:49 GMT 11
Hi All, Took the car to the Nissan dealership in Chatswood two weeks ago. They've been following all recommendations from the Nissan Australia technical in Melbourne. One request was to drive car 4x from full to empty. They were getting 46km + 20km left over driving under 50km/hr with eco mode and no aircon. Other less efficient instances are 40 to 50km total range. They did not record how much charge went into it. They updated the ECU data to have more accurate range estimation (apparently). Nissan got back to say that everything is within spec, and won't do anything about it. I am starting a complaint process with them. The car only took 14kW/hr of charge when it had 9km left of range, it has a bad battery cell, and range is appalling. I guess they don't want to splash out $5k in a replacement battery... Nissan dealership guy has been very supportive, and told me that he expected this would happen, but that he thinks I have a good case. I guess it wasn't going to be easy. :) Feel free to share any thoughts if you had a similar experience, that I can use as arguments. Something weird happening there. I have been hovering around 14kWh (100%) for months and now down to 13.8kWh(ish). I always get 90km or more around town at 50kph. I can even get 80km+ on a 60km trip to the nearest big town at 80kph.
I reset the odometer at each 100% charge and watch the GOM + distance traveled as the capacity is used up. I always start with 0km odometer and 120km(ish) on the GOM. After a week around local my typical would be 80km traveled and 12 left on the GOM.
After each "tank full" I usually finish with an economy of 13kWh per 100km or better on the dash.
Are you using a LEAF Spy app with the ODB gadget?
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seb
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Post by seb on Aug 5, 2019 14:15:52 GMT 11
Hi Jeff. I think so too. Yes. I used leafspy but that’s the range the dealership is reporting in their test drive following Nissan’s recommendations. I think it’s a broken cell that is causing imbalance on my 2012 Nissan Leaf. My wife had the turtle come up with 20km range left / two bars!
Do you know if the Nissan battery capacity is 14kwhr or 24kWhr on the 2012? Is yours also the 2012?
I’ve read all around it’s 24kWhr but everyone here is talking about 14kwhr.
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Post by jeffthewalker on Aug 5, 2019 16:50:58 GMT 11
Hi Jeff. I think so too. Yes. I used leafspy but that’s the range the dealership is reporting in their test drive following Nissan’s recommendations. I think it’s a broken cell that is causing imbalance on my 2012 Nissan Leaf. My wife had the turtle come up with 20km range left / two bars! Do you know if the Nissan battery capacity is 14kwhr or 24kWhr on the 2012? Is yours also the 2012? I’ve read all around it’s 24kWhr but everyone here is talking about 14kwhr. Mine is 2012 build. Nissan only ever imported one batch into Australia.
2012 is 24kWh of which 21kWh is "usable". And that is usable when "brand new". The Aussie 2012s sat around the importer's yard for a year or 5 and when I got mine in late 2015 I reckon it was lucky to hit 19kWh for 100% charge. However, that is just guessing as I did not know what I was doing in those early, hypnotic days:-).
Actually still mostly hypnotic. I love to drive my LEAF and several times a year I do over 1,000km trips.
With a bit of luck, my battery will lose its 4th bar "soon" as I am now down to SOH 63.72%. From what I read it should lose its 4th bar after being less than 64.13% SOH for 1 month. I am now several months. I still have plenty of time and distance to run under warranty.
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seb
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Post by seb on Aug 5, 2019 17:24:46 GMT 11
Thanks! Range in my case doesn’t correlate with your battery charge. The turtle is not a good sign.
Interesting question (I hope): Why is the SOH not the capacity for the battery to hold charge? If the car starts at 21kwh and you can only push 14kwh (which should be less once you account for charging inefficiency), then SOH should be 14/21 66% SOH while my car shows 77%, right?
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Post by jeffthewalker on Aug 6, 2019 6:42:56 GMT 11
Thanks! Range in my case doesn’t correlate with your battery charge. The turtle is not a good sign. Interesting question (I hope): Why is the SOH not the capacity for the battery to hold charge? If the car starts at 21kwh and you can only push 14kwh (which should be less once you account for charging inefficiency), then SOH should be 14/21 66% SOH while my car shows 77%, right? I have no answer for that. I have never been able to make correlations like that work out. Even economy at the end of a tankful never comes out when I calculate distance traveled against kWh used.
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seb
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Post by seb on Aug 8, 2019 12:00:39 GMT 11
Maybe battery health is an average of battery capacity to deliver power and actual storage capacity? Either way, only been able to charge up to 14kWh when it has 28kWh (or even 21kwhr) is not indicative of a healthy battery.
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seb
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Post by seb on Aug 26, 2019 21:19:30 GMT 11
I may be getting a new battery (yay!). It's been a bit or a saga. Should have taken the car to Nissan Suttons in the first instance! They assessed the battery issue in one day.
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Post by Cachexian (Gordon) on Sept 2, 2019 22:06:29 GMT 11
I may be getting a new battery (yay!). It's been a bit or a saga. Should have taken the car to Nissan Suttons in the first instance! They assessed the battery issue in one day. That sounds positive. I hope you do manage to get a new battery!
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Post by Cachexian (Gordon) on Sept 2, 2019 22:08:42 GMT 11
Does anyone see something dodgy, or that I should be looking out, ask about? Just the whole turtle mode while there's still a battery bar remaining looks unusual. If they let you take it for a test drive it'll be obvious that something's not right. Also pop the bonnet and remove the plastic covers near the bottom corners of the windscreen. See how rusty the bolts above the struts are. More discussion here: ozleaf.proboards.com/thread/726/cleaning-leaves-leafIt's possible for a dealer to reset the capacity bars and there's at least one person on the mynissanleaf.com forum who bought what they thought was a good deal only to wonder why the capacity took a dive in the following weeks. Feng, Whaaa? What do you mean the dealer has the ability to reset the bars? And they use the number of lost bars as the test to decide if they should do a warranty repair on the battery? There is something seriously wrong there.
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seb
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Post by seb on Sept 12, 2019 12:21:05 GMT 11
Hi Gordon. It took a bit of fighting. The cell that is off is barely passing (but passing) their internal tests, (although throwing the entire battery off-balance). Nissan Australia was not going to fix it, but the guys at Nissan Suttons insisted, and they reopened the case. So looks like they will (at least) replace the bad cell. Let's see how long that takes (anyone have experience on battery replacement delivery times?).
My final conclusion if this is good or not is how much charge I can actually push into the battery when fully empty. Thats the only objective way to know in my view.
With regards to the number of bars you discuss, the basic report at dealership simply reports number of bars, with some commentary. But either a proper Nissan dealership or a light dealership are definitely able to tell individual battery cell levels (or report them back to Nissan Australia)
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